Is Lsd Back ?
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Morphine replied on Fri Mar 25, 2005 @ 9:46am |
 Coolness: 50920 | youre talking based on heresay and information you havent even bothered to check out for yourself. "my friend said....", "i heard....."...
all the arguments made in this thread by poisoned candy and insomniak contain all the information to disprove what youre saying. this information has a scientific basis which cant be refuted. so theres not too much point in arguing with you because you seem convinced beyond a reasonable doubt of the knowledge you think you have. if i or poisoned candy or insomniak were to spend time digging through the available information to compile an exhaustive list of the facts required to prove you wrong, it would just be a waste of time. so thanks for the "informative" lesson on lsd there leary, but i'll keep my own counsel. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» OoOLuShYsOoO replied on Sun Mar 27, 2005 @ 4:04pm |
 Coolness: 47140 | The bomb acid is in California, I will never forget the craziest trip of my entire life.
Made any acid I've ever had around these parts seem like complete crap |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Trey replied on Sun Mar 27, 2005 @ 5:37pm |
 Coolness: 102715 | California Sunshine!!!
so good i don't remember how i ended up in NYC... |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Mon Mar 28, 2005 @ 5:57am |
 Coolness: 92215 | Originally posted by MORPHINE...
youre talking based on heresay and information you havent even bothered to check out for yourself. "my friend said....", "i heard....."... all the arguments made in this thread by poisoned candy and insomniak contain all the information to disprove what youre saying. this information has a scientific basis which cant be refuted. so theres not too much point in arguing with you because you seem convinced beyond a reasonable doubt of the knowledge you think you have. if i or poisoned candy or insomniak were to spend time digging through the available information to compile an exhaustive list of the facts required to prove you wrong, it would just be a waste of time. so thanks for the "informative" lesson on lsd there leary, but i'll keep my own counsel. I told you what I heard, I also told you I don`t know if it`s the truth. I also don`t see your ``unrefutable scientific evidence`` and i dont care. All I know for sure is that they put PC in acid often enough and if you have a problem with that.. well deal with it. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» smike1011b replied on Thu May 5, 2005 @ 9:17pm |
 Coolness: 34975 | if it is I want some |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» thehemeraproject replied on Fri May 6, 2005 @ 11:21am |
| Coolness: 42700 | Alright whatever, If any of you have decent stuff, or have access to, send me a msg or something. I have tried 4 blotters of the same guy, and I want to compare with another source. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» smike1011b replied on Fri May 6, 2005 @ 11:41pm |
| Coolness: 34975 | Originally posted by RANDOMJUNKIE...
Alright whatever, If any of you have decent stuff, or have access to, send me a msg or something. I have tried 4 blotters of the same guy, and I want to compare with another source. Umm, how bout you send me some blotters in the mail in exchange for a few grams dxm pure? lol, i know, its a long shot ;p |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Oliver_TwisteD replied on Wed May 11, 2005 @ 2:32am |
 Coolness: 85635 | i had some a couple weeks ago for the first time in 3 years- it was a blast.. definatly my new drug of choice. An hour and a half after i dropped we were out in the backyard with the tripod and camera making a stopmotion movie where sticks chase a wagon, the wagon gets pissed off, seeks the assistance of a pitchfork and pulverizes the pile of sticks- it was very rewarding seeing the results.. since then i've been practicing my claymation and stopmotion techniques.. Trippy stuff!! also, my art.. (music/marker drawings/etc.) have been alot more interesting-
ps- i'm looking for some.. if anyone I know can help me out- :b thanks! I need to make more acid influenced art!! |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» thehemeraproject replied on Thu May 12, 2005 @ 5:40pm |
| Coolness: 42700 | I'm not into DXM. I'd send you some for something more universal though.
Someone talked to me about some "liquid acid", but it wasn't (according to him) LSD. Anyone could give me some info on this ? What could it be ? (I know, acid is overused as a word...) |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Oliver_TwisteD replied on Thu May 12, 2005 @ 7:32pm |
| Coolness: 85635 | some of the best acid i've ever had was in liquid form- my friend got it from someone he knew who had a vile, put a couple drops on some sugar cubes. it was great, everything was smooth and trippy. it felt cleaner than other acid i've had, but that was a one time thing. i read an article about it in vice once.. they were talking about how good it was-heheh |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» smike1011b replied on Sat May 14, 2005 @ 9:40am |
| Coolness: 34975 | Originally posted by RANDOMJUNKIE...
I'm not into DXM. I'd send you some for something more universal though. alright, how bout a few grams of mushrooms, spore prints, syringes, whatever you need?!?! |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Dark_Angel_2 replied on Sat May 14, 2005 @ 11:57am |
 Coolness: 69350 | i havnt done acid in yeeeeearssss. i loved dropping though, wouldn't mind trying a little one day cause this thread is givin' me madd cravings!!! |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» the_rider replied on Sun May 15, 2005 @ 12:08am |
 Coolness: 42195 | One of my friends got some Happy Face blotters. We did them last week, it was nice.
Sure, LSD is back. Some dealers can even get blotters in rural areas, but they are a little more expensive there |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» the_rider replied on Sun May 15, 2005 @ 12:26am |
| Coolness: 42195 | Originally posted by MOONDANCER...
LSD is supposed to be made with morning glory as well as ergot. A traditionnal way of synthesis of LSD is from ergotamine tartrate. But, the stuff is scheduled, it is impossible to get it from regular chemical suppliers. I "guess" there are some alternative way to get ergotamine tartrate (maybe by extraction from some plant, or by a more conventionnal synthesis, but I never had the chance to have access enough to a GC-MS to find natural sources of ET, or studied enough how to get ET from legal chemicals). But, even when you have some ergotamine tartrate, it's not all done, the reaction from ET to LSD must be done under inert atmosphere. Morning glory contains LSA, a compound similar to LSD. I guess there would be a way to get LSD from LSA, but it's not a way of synthesis tradionnaly found in books, like the one from ET. Also, it would need some work in finding a way to get rid of the other ergot alkaloids contained in the morning glory. Synthesis of LSD is not an easy thing, it needs a lot of knowledge. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Oliver_TwisteD replied on Sun May 15, 2005 @ 3:42pm |
| Coolness: 85635 | hmmm.. i dropped some with a friend a few days ago- the strange thing was that we split 1 hit, yet i tripped harder than ever before. i'd never had such vivid hallucinations- Plus i was actually able to get some art and music done. we went kite flying at 3 am by the river. it was quite the surreal adventure. the moonlight was making the trees change colours.. green to pink to blue and so on, i sunk into the ground up to my waste, then pulled myself out- and i even thought i saw a ran over cat in a pool of blood, with it's eye hanging out.. it turned out it was just a paper bag, the eye was a piece of tape, the blood was the shadow- it was fuckin awesome! i remember it the same way as i would with a strange dream-
anyway.. point being, BE CAREFUL.. some acid is way stronger than other acid- i'm glad i didn't take 2 hits of this stuff! even 1 would've been too much- |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Mon May 16, 2005 @ 3:47am |
| Coolness: 92215 | Originally posted by THE_RIDER...
Originally posted by moondancer...
LSD is supposed to be made with morning glory as well as ergot. I "guess" there are some alternative way to get ergotamine tartrate (maybe by extraction from some plant, or by a more conventionnal synthesis, but I never had the chance to have access enough to a GC-MS to find natural sources of ET, or studied enough how to get ET from legal chemicals). Ergot is a fungus that grows on rye plants. Nowadays they remove any ergot from the rye before they make bread with it. They didn't realise it was the ergot that was makign them halluicinate in the middle ages so they made the bread with it and it is attributed to the mass amount of werewolf stories. Of course there aren't many people with rye fields full of fungus so very few ppl have the tools to make LSD. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Dark_Angel_2 replied on Mon May 23, 2005 @ 10:12pm |
| Coolness: 69350 | i saw a special(about ergot) on TLC. ya cause the poor could only afford rye bread so they were the majority of peeps who saw werewolves and so on............FUCKIN GOOD SHOW, haven't seen it in a while tho. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Tue May 24, 2005 @ 3:56am |
| Coolness: 92215 | Yeah I saw that show too, it was really interesting.,
II. A HERETICAL VIEWPOINT I intend to advance the heretical viewpoint that there is tremendous variation in the quality of drugs found in blotters, and that few such preparations illicitly available since the mid-1970s even come close to pure LSD-25 in the capacity for expanding consciousness. In the following I first examine the syllogism then move to a discussion of subjective effects and anecdotes about purity. A: An analysis of the Syllogism I now proceed to examine the assumptions and conclusions of the syllogism outlined above 1) A blotter can only hold about 200 ug of drug material Not necessarily true. Blotters vary in size, some weighing up to several milligrams in weight, and I have seen blotters that were saturated with added materials. I will examine (2) and (3) together. 2) Only the d isomer of LSD is active in such quantity 3) All illicit 'acid' packaged in blotter form owes all of its psychoactive effects to LSD-25 and thus any difference in subjective or physical effects are entirely due to difference in dose, set, or setting. Not true. 1: Several other *known* drugs are active in such quantities. Here are a few, listed with typical psychoactive doses: drug dose (ug) ---- --------- LSD 100-1000 nicotine 300 scopolamine 500 atropine 500 carbachol 200 aminopentamide 500 colchicine 100 fentanyl 100 etorphine 100 resperine 250 Some of these drugs are very cheap and easy to obtain, such as socpolamine and atropine. Even methamphetamine is active in doses as low as 1 mg. 2: LSD-25 may potentiate other materials that are normally inactive. Even minute ammounts of amphetamine can significantly potentiate LSD, and change the quality of the effect. The same may be true of other lysergic acid derivatives and by-products in a blotter. 3: All the discussion I have seen about psychoactive by-products and residues in blotters has focused on known such known products as the 4 isomers of LSD, variations on the anide group, known lysergic amines, etc. The information about these chemicals appears to be based on assays of extraction and synthesis products based on high-quality processes using materials and reagents of pharmaceutical quality. What goes on in illicit drug labs may be an entirely different story. Question: What happens when you substitute the hydrogens on any of the various positions of the lysergic backbone with some other element or compound? How do differences in saturation affect its qualities? If the base molecule is LSD it may still have very high potency, but qualitatively very different (eg: muddled) effects. 4: The mechanism by which LSD alters consciousness is not understood. The fact that only 0.001% of a dose crosses the blood-brain barrier, and it leaves the brain within an hour suggests that it's mechanism of action is very different from most drugs, so generalizations about purity/quality based on other drugs should be used with caution. Perhaps there are phenomena of synchronization, synergy, or resonance in the neural response patterns to LSD that are disrupted or muted by the presence of variants of LSD at LSD receptors (if they exist). We simply don't know, and to pretend we can speak with certainty about such things is to indulge in hubris. B: What lsd.data Proves The analysis results in lsd.data proves that the vast majority of alleged LSD samples analyzed in 1973 and 1974 tested positive for LSD, and did not test positive for whatever other drugs they were testing for. Relevant questions include: How selective were the LSD identification tests used? and How many other drugs were tested for? In any case, based on numerous reports, I believe most of the acid available during those years was of high quality and was similar if not identical to LSD-25. The consistency of quality didn't start to plummet until the mid-1970s, due in part to restricted availability of chemicals required for synthesis. A recent post (arguing in favor of the Doctrine) is instructive. : > In the 60s, it never seemed that certain charachteristics were assigned to > different batches. Acid was acid. Only when printed blotters really > started taking off in the late 70s (replacing pills, microdots, windowpane, > etc) did people start giving charachteristics to blotter. C: Subjective Evidence Supporting the Heresy There is abundant subjective evidence that since the prohibition of LSD, and particularly since the mid-1970s the illicit psychoactive preparations having effective doses in the sub-milligram range (eg-blotters), called acid or LSD, have baseline effects (independent of dose, set, or setting) which vary over a wide spectrum. This distribution of effects may be highly modal and centralized, with the vast majority of acid available at a given time having very similar effects, perhaps even comming from only a few sources; and this may give users who have only sampled acid for a few years the impression that it's all the same, and thus little reason to doubt it's authenticity or quality. However, virtually any connoisseur of acid who has a discerning mind and a good memory, and has sampled illicit offerings for several decades (starting in the 60's or early 70's) knows that quality is a very real and important issue. I will leave it to the reader to seek out the opinions of veterans of the the first psychedelic era. D: Weighing Subjective Evidence Against the Gospel The syllogism supporting the Doctrine has gaping holes in it. It, in combination with other supporting evidence, may tend to support the case: [a] Most blotter acid is owes most of its activity to lysergic acid derivaties structurally similar to LSD (and perhaps testing positive for it). But it certainly doesn't make the case: [b ] All blotter acid owes all of its activity to LSD-25, whose pharmacological action is unmodified by impurities. What can one learn from subjective experiences induced by acid? The proponents of the central dogma contend that since the effects of LSD are highly susceptible to set, setting, and dose, users' attributions of differences in effects to differences in the drug are groundless. It is true that variables such as set, setting and dose are extremely influential in determining the subjective effects of LSD. In fact the LSD experience is probably more susceptable to these effects than any other drug known. This does not mean that a discerning user is incapable of separating to a significant or high degree such variables from variations in drug quality. It is very much a function of the aptitude and experience of the user. Some people can readily distinguish the effects of pure mescaline from those of the mixture of alkaloids found in Peyote. Others can't distinguish between the distinctly different effects of Psilocybin and LSD. To illustrate the capacity for discriminating between drug quality and other variables I offer the following metaphor: Think of LSD as a window through which you look into a different world. Your position relative to the window, and what is on the other side represents set and setting. The clarity of the window represents the quality of the drug. Now your position and the scene outside the window can change dramatically, but reguardless you are still capable of perceiving the clarity of the window. Moreover, if you had never looked through a window before, and you were given a cloudy one to look through and told it was LSD, you would have no reason to doubt its authenticity because you have never had the experience of looking through a clear one. III. GUIDEBOOK FOR UNBELIEVERS A: Subjective Indications of Quality The following table is provided as a resource for evaluating the effects of acid. Effects of other drugs are listed for comparison purposes. Scores are normalized for dose, meaning that a given score is expressed as a ratio to the overall effect of the drug. Thus, for example, taking larger doses of scopolamine cannot be used to approximate LSD-like synesthetic experiences, as other effects of the drug, such as delirium, get in the way. Similar dose-related phenomena limit the mind-expanding capacities of most acid. Note: this table is based on extensive but imperfect data, and necessarily involves subjective elements. Readers who disagree with my scoring are encouraged to write me with their opinions, which will all me to improve my data. code drug ---- ---- LSD - LSD-25 LAA - crude lysergic amines, from HBWR Mes - mescaline TMA - TMA Amp - methamphetamine Psi - psilocin Sco - scopolamine & atropine acid - various blotter acid 1975-92 effect LSD LAA Mes TMA Amp Psi Sco acid ------ --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ----- pharmacology: dose (mg) 0.3 8 800 30 3 30 2 < 2 onset (hours) 1.0 1.0 0.7 0.5 0.4 0.4 1.5 0.5- 1.0 peak (hours) 3.0 3.5 4.0 3.0 3.0 1.6 3.5 2.0- 3.0 termination (hours) 12 8 15 15 15 6 8 6 - 10 physiological: pupil dilation 7 8 6 5 3 7 9 5 - 9 nausea 1 8 2 2 3 4 0 1 - 8 increased heart rate 2 2 3 4 6 2 4 2 - 7 perceptual: transparency of hallucinations 8 6 5 4 3 4 2 2 - 5 information content of hallucinations 9 9 6 7 2 3 1 1 - 5 symmetry of hallucinations 6 6 9 6 2 4 0 1 - 5 detail of hallucinations 9 3 7 6 1 3 1 0 - 6 sequential afterimages or 'trails' 7 4 8 4 2 4 1 1 - 7 color enhancement 6 2 9 5 1 7 0 0 - 5 Synesthesia 9 4 7 5 2 4 1 1 - 5 cognitive: concentration 7 4 9 5 2 3 0 -3 - 4 association 8 2 7 3 2 5 2 1 - 5 task impairment 2 5 3 2 1 5 9 4 - 9 memory of experience 6 7 9 8 4 6 -5 -2 - 4 subjective: expansiveness 8 2 9 5 1 4 1 1 - 5 time dilation 8 2 5 4 4 6 0 2 - 6 exaggeration, caricature 9 3 5 3 2 7 0 1 - 6 emotive content of hallucinations 5 5 4 3 2 7 8 1 - 4 imagination/fantasy 9 3 7 3 1 5 6 1 - 5 recollective: long-term memory accessibility 9 3 5 3 2 2 -1 -1 - 3 access to subconscious 9 3 6 4 1 3 2 0 - 3 self-perception: ego dissolution 9 6 6 4 1 5 1 2 - 8 out-of-body experience 7 6 5 4 2 5 8 2 - 8 side-effects: post-experience lethargy 0 2 -2 0 3 3 4 0 - 5 residual headaches 0 0 0 0 0 2 5 0 - 6 B: Precautions Beware of blotters which have a bitter tast or appear to be stained with color. LSD is tasteless and colorless. When first sampling acid from a batch of unknown quality, take a fraction of a dosage unit to ascertain the quality and strength of effects. Pay attention to the onset, and duration of effects, and to side effects. If the experience is smooth, free of noticable side effects, and matches the profile of LSD reasonably well, consider doubling the dosage next time (after at least 3 days have elapsed). C: Storage Oxygen, UV light, and moisture degrade LSD, and the rate of most reactions increases at least with the square of the absolute temperature. Therefore it should be kept tightly wrapped in cellophane (crinkly) plastic (not polyethylene or aluminum, which may react with it), and, if feasible, refrigerated. It may also help to sprinkle some ascorbic acid crystals (vitamin C) in the package to act as an oxygen scavenger. III. THE GOSPEL AND THE POLITICS OF LSD The proponents of the Gospel seem to be motivated by a desire to dispell fears about the quality and adulteration of acid which discourage experimentation. Quoting from the FAQ: > (It is common for the uninformed to harbor fears (e.g., about adulterants) > instilled by ignorance and the current hysteria/propoganda. That's why this > FAQ exists.) It goes to some length to (correctly) dispell the myth of strychnine adulteration. However it does not credibly address the possibility of other adulterants or the possibility of the presence of LSD-analogs which could greatly alter the effect. I do not question the sincerity or motives of those who promulgate the Doctrine; only their uncritical and dogmatic adherence to an apparently logical conclusion. I believe that while attempting to counteract the mis- understanding and mis-information, about psychedelic drugs endemic to our culture, they are unwittingly doing a great dis-service in contending that most acid is indistinguishable from perfect LSD. As an entire generation accepts the conventional wisdom that the often mediocre psychedelic preparations called acid are one and the same with LSD, the memory of the most mind-expanding and liberating drug ever discovered is being buried. APPENDIX: Holy Scripture Revisited One way of fanning the flames of blasphemy is to cast doubt on the prophets. I present for your evaluation the following quotes from the Psychedelic Chemistry by Michael Valentine Smith: p9: > These compounds can be extracted and used to synthesized > the active THC and THC acid (by smoking, not active orally). THC not active orally? Really? p8: > Cannabis Sativa has been a cherished friend ... > ... The genus Cannabis contains only this one species, What about Cannabis Indica and Cannabis Rootaralis? p5: > few compounds will produce a significant effect until a hundred to a > thousand times this amount (200 ug) has been ingested. Really? About half of the psyhoactive compounds listed in my pharmacology book are active in doses of less than 10mg. (200ug * 50). > Even mescaline, which has a rather specific psychedelic effect, requires > about a thousand times this amount. "Even mescaline"!? -- It's the *least* potent of the well-known psychedelics. Note: I think this book offers some insights, but it seems to be lacking in consistency and authority. Also it was originally written before the mid-1970s, when most acid was, for the most part, indistinguishable from pharmaceutical LSD. Even so, M. V. Smith casts doubt: p5: > It is possible that iso-LSD may block LSD effects somewhat and inhibit the > cosmic trips that can result from high doses; this is however unproven. soucre: [ www.erowid.org ] LSD Purity - Cleanliness is next to godliness From High Times, January 1977 By Bruce Eisner excerpt ... Because of the imprecise nature of the street-drug market, a number of street drug-testing programs were established in the 1970s. These drug organizations have repeatedly labeled most street samples of underground acid as "LSD." For example, the Straight Dope Newsletter, a compilation of information from U. S. testing organizations, reported on a total of 209 samples turned in to the various organizations during the period from March 1973 thru July 1973, of which 183 samples were "LSD." PharmChem of Palo Alto, California, the most noted of the various street drug testing groups, reported in 1973: "Of 405 samples said to be LSD, 91.6 percent were as alleged, 3.4 percent had no drug at all, 3 percent were actually DOM, PCP and others, and 2 percent had DOM, PCP and methamphetamine in addition to LSD." Contrast these two reports to a survey abstracted in LSD - A Total Study (edited by D. V. Siva Sankar): "Marshman and Gibbons tested 519 samples of street drugs for which the vendor's claimed composition was available. Of the samples alleged to be LSD, 44 percent contained LSD with two or more contaminants or even were mixtures of intermediate chemicals resulting from the failed attempts to synthesize LSD." ... |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» FaUst replied on Thu Jun 30, 2005 @ 7:14am |
 Coolness: 88680 | LSD nice story
4 years ago I went in a rave on the top of the Mount Ste-Anne, and there was a guy in the only black telepheric who had a complete bottle of LSD and he was giving some to everybody who was going in...I think he did it all nigh...I had 3 or 4 little drops and I had one of the best trip of my life... It was like taking 10 acids, but fucking nice...Does anyone was there??? |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» earthyspirit replied on Thu Jun 30, 2005 @ 11:06pm |
 Coolness: 229625 | aww we can only wish. |
Is Lsd Back ?
[ Cumbre de Página ] |
Post A Reply |
You must be logged in to post a reply.
[ Cumbre de Página ] |
