A Nation Of Immigrants
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» nothingnopenope replied on Wed Dec 12, 2007 @ 5:57pm |
 Coolness: 201270 | In the case of some of the radical islamic groups:
They don't just use suicide bombings against tanks and soldiers, they use it against innocent civilians. They largely use religious motivations to encourage young people who have nothing to kill themselves for their cause. They often recruit them in or around mosques! An atheist suicide bomber would have to do a lot more to legitimize their action. There is an extra layer or insight and logic to killing yourself and others, because you believe that life is over when it's over. |
| I'm feeling gangsta right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» PoiSoNeD_CaNdY replied on Wed Dec 12, 2007 @ 7:01pm |
 Coolness: 91735 | Is there a battle waging between Western economic/hegemonic interests and fundamentalist Islam? Absolutely.
Are suicide bombings a weapon used by fundamentalist Islamists to target the West? Of course. Are attacks which either target civilians, or cause excessive "collateral damage" immoral? Definetly. However, is there anything inherent in the Islamic religion which promotes violence against the innocent? No Let's not forget that the two greatest terrorist attacks in history didn't involve suicide bombing, or Islam. They involved atomic bombing, and cost the lives of over 160,000 civilians. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» nothingnopenope replied on Wed Dec 12, 2007 @ 7:22pm |
| Coolness: 201270 | However, is there anything inherent in the Islamic religion which promotes violence against the innocent
Perhaps the fact that the religion was created by someone who was essentially a warlord, and killed a bunch of people? Update » nothingnopenope wrote on Wed Dec 12, 2007 @ 7:26pm HE EVEN SPLIT THE MOON IN HALF! HE ATTACKED THE MOON! |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Captain.Obvious replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 1:35am |
 Coolness: 32270 | If you think there's nothing wrong with Islam, I strongly suggest you read the book i mentioned earlier "the end of faith" by sam harris, specifically chapter 4 which highlights some extremely disturbing statistics about Muslims as well as pages 117 through 123 are quotes directly from the Koran, each of which teach that infidels must be killed. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» nothingnopenope replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 1:38am |
| Coolness: 201270 | [ www.guba.com ]
Irshad Manji, Canadian who wants reform in Islam, especially for women. She has bulletproof glass on her house and a lock on her mailbox. Guess why. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» basdini replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 5:14am |
 Coolness: 145245 | Originally Posted By SCOTTYP [ WWW.GUBA.COM ] IRSHAD MANJI, CANADIAN WHO WANTS REFORM IN ISLAM, ESPECIALLY FOR WOMEN. SHE HAS BULLETPROOF GLASS ON HER HOUSE AND A LOCK ON HER MAILBOX. GUESS WHY.
but have you ever actually read her book "The Trouble With Islam" even if she is critical of islam she still finds it positive in many ways (like the notion of 'itijihad' or free though and interpretation within islamic traditions) I'm not gonna pretend islam is perfect, i am not that naive or myopic, at the same time i wont hang it out to dry. the problem with people's perception of islam is that it's so wrapped in terrorism and repression that it's easy to forget that it is literally the 'religion of peace'... |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Captain.Obvious replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 8:12am |
| Coolness: 32270 | Originally Posted By BASDINI
it's easy to forget that it is literally the 'religion of peace'... I disagree. Nothing I've seen of islam makes me believe that. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Deadfunk replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 8:26am |
 Coolness: 153050 | basdini, i really dont understand, you say its religion of peace, but they kill in the name of religion.
yeah, religion of peace when they will have killed everyone who dont believe in their religion, then its gonna be peace, ohhh, i understand now! |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 9:48am |
 Coolness: 92310 | You're just saying the same wrong thing over and over. I don't see people killing in the name of religion, I see people killing who probably would have killed anyway justifying their actions religiously because they are religious. When a christian wants to do somethign and believes it is necessary that's what they do.
The Koran is full of violence and dumb stuff said by prophets and things which are completely inappropriate in modern times but were very normal in mideival times. NEWS FLASH. So is the bible. It's amazing how you people manage to justify your knit-picking. Behind this whole idea of islam beign violent is a bunch of nut case fundamentalist christians who you would laugh your ass off if you heard them speaking. Congratulations on listening to the message of complete fascist dumbasses who's only positive contribution to the world will be to make the rest of us laugh and piss ourselves. They hate muslims because muslims believe that mohammed was a prophet sent to unite people after jesus failed. Mohammed was not a "warlord". Not in the Koran he isn't, and if it does say this in the Koran than it is not widely known among muslims. What actually happened in history may be another story btu back then certain types of violence were common place or socially acceptable and normal muslims wouldn't even know about any of that. He was an army commander of a city called Medina, his job was to protect the city. He is seen by muslims as a protector and someone who acted in defense, often strategically(ie if he had to lie to win a battle he would). Jesus said some pretty damn fucked up contrary to christian values shit. It's one thing to say these books are dumb and outdated, that I can agree with but don't start making comparisons between islam and christianity. It's easy to pick out all the bad stuff that's cleary wrong and ignore all the good stuff. Wasn't there a thread before about all the insanely fucke dup shit in the bible and insanely immoral things that saints abnd prophets have done/said? I'm sure that even the absolute worst shit that mohammed said can be paralleled by the bible. Doesn't any of this ever occur to you when you see this shit? It's not the little dumb things in these constantly self contradictive books that matters anyway, its the sum of everything. Whenever someone tries to tell you that an entire group of people is deeply and unchangeably violently motivated and/or out to kill you you should ask yourself if what you're seeing is too good to be true. Cause you are beign idealistic. You just want to believe the problem is as simple as 1 group of people you don't belong to. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» PoiSoNeD_CaNdY replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 11:13am |
| Coolness: 91735 | Originally Posted By CAPTAIN.OBVIOUS IF YOU THINK THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH ISLAM, I STRONGLY SUGGEST YOU READ THE BOOK I MENTIONED EARLIER "THE END OF FAITH" BY SAM HARRIS, SPECIFICALLY CHAPTER 4 WHICH HIGHLIGHTS SOME EXTREMELY DISTURBING STATISTICS ABOUT MUSLIMS AS WELL AS PAGES 117 THROUGH 123 ARE QUOTES DIRECTLY FROM THE KORAN, EACH OF WHICH TEACH THAT INFIDELS MUST BE KILLED.
If you really want to learn anything about Islam, don't rely on selected quotes from the Koran taken out of context or read books written by obviously anti-Islamic authors. Instead, why not actually try going to a mosque, and having a dialogue with Moslems about their faith. Beleive it or not, they will NOT be trying to kill you for being an infidel :D I'm speaking from experience. I've travelled in several prodeomanaly Moslem countries, including Syria, Egypt, and Jordan. I've also visited the Palestinian parts of Jerusalem and the Occupied West Bank. According to you, since i'm an "infidel" which all Moslems want to kill, I shouldn't be alive right now and typing this message. In fact, the vast majority of people I met were exetremely hospitable and friendly. I actually noticed that the more religious a person seemed (wearing traditional dress, a long beard, etc) the more likely they were to display incredible acts of warmth and kindness, and LESS likely to want to cheat you or rip you off. So get your head out of your book of quotations and actually learn something about Islam. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Captain.Obvious replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 1:55pm |
| Coolness: 32270 | That's ok, refute what was written in a book without reading it. Shows how unbiased you are. Update » Captain.Obvious wrote on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 1:59pm If you don't like "The End of Faith" how about "God is Not Great" by Christopher Hitchens, a very well known reporter who has been to pretty much every country in the world and seen pretty much everything that is to see.
His feelings on Islam are very clear. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» nothingnopenope replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 2:07pm |
| Coolness: 201270 | My main criticism is that the moslem community as a whole will not even hear out their own critics who were raised moslem.
They almost always receive many death threats and require bodyguards and security round the clock, and that's in NORTH AMERICAN AND EUROPEAN COUNTRIES! The Koran is full of violence and dumb stuff said by prophets and things which are completely inappropriate in modern times but were very normal in mideival times. NEWS FLASH.
YES, but the problem is people are still trying to apply those 7th century values TODAY. That is one of the main arguments in Irshad Manji's documentary. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» PoiSoNeD_CaNdY replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 4:38pm |
| Coolness: 91735 | YES, but the problem is people are still trying to apply those 7th century values TODAY. That is one of the main arguments in Irshad Manji's documentary.
This is a valid point concerning Muslem fundamentalism, which by definition means that the scripture is taken literally and any modification or revision is considered to be heresy. But clearly, not all Muslems or predomenantly Muslem states are fundamentalist. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» nothingnopenope replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 5:43pm |
| Coolness: 201270 | If you actually watched the video I posted, you would see that she is talking about North America and Europe in most of it, not even Islamic states. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Captain.Obvious replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 6:35pm |
| Coolness: 32270 | Take mideval thinking and add modern weapons to the mix. Great combination. |
| I'm feeling apparent right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» basdini replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 10:12pm |
| Coolness: 145245 | Originally Posted By CAPTAIN.OBVIOUS
ORIGINALLY POSTED BY BASDINI IT'S EASY TO FORGET THAT IT IS LITERALLY THE 'RELIGION OF PEACE'... I DISAGREE. NOTHING I'VE SEEN OF ISLAM MAKES ME BELIEVE THAT. it's not my discription of islam...it's actually known as the 'religion of peace' (try googling 'religion of peace' and you will get links to muslim stuff...) that fact that it is known as such is not an accident...i just wanted to point that out because i don't think that it was clear in my last post... |
| I'm feeling surly right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» JojoBizarre replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 10:24pm |
 Coolness: 295020 | at the beginning all religion is about peace, it's the dumbass who control it, twist it, and rearange the word to get more power that corrupted the religions... |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Captain.Obvious replied on Thu Dec 13, 2007 @ 10:25pm |
| Coolness: 32270 | If a serial murderer called himself a messenger of peace and love, would you be inclined to believe him based on words alone?
Saying something and doing another does not make it so. The only religion of peace I've seen is Buddhism, where pacifism is actively taught. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Deadfunk replied on Sat Dec 15, 2007 @ 9:56am |
| Coolness: 153050 | moondancer, i find christian religion is the same, if not worst. you seem to believe im a christian white ass redneck racist, in your last post, wich i am not.
but hey, i think what i want, so you can think what you want, right? =) |
| I'm feeling hardcore right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Mon Dec 17, 2007 @ 8:53am |
| Coolness: 92310 | Right :) |
| I'm feeling bored right now.. | |
A Nation Of Immigrants
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