If You'Re Not Voting For The Bloc Quebecois Read This
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Shindy a répondu le Fri 21 Nov, 2008 @ 4:14pm |
 Coolness: 171855 | ouf.... |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Mico a répondu le Fri 21 Nov, 2008 @ 5:24pm |
 Coolness: 150475 | pou-poum tchi! |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Fri 21 Nov, 2008 @ 7:57pm |
 Coolness: 339680 | Originally Posted By CLOWN
Yeah Neo, what the hell do you want him to say now?? he made it quite clear that arguing with you was as productive as calling the wall an idiot and expecting it to fight back. and whats the problem with Bill 101 ?? it's about the only thing that saved our province from the english world. nothing wrong with that as it was part of quebec's heritage to have french as #1 !!! What's your problem Vince? I don't recall insulting you, but coming from you, I take what you just said quite personally. Saved Quebec from the English world? wtf does that even mean? |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Nathan a répondu le Fri 21 Nov, 2008 @ 8:24pm |
 Coolness: 166560 | i think it means that this province has been fighting assimilation since it's birth. I'm not a huge fan of bill 101 either (if businesses want to lose $ 'cause they don't serve/post in french, it's their problem) but at least it was a good way to fight back without breaking out the machettes. What if Canada was french, wouldn't you fight to keep english in your hometown? It's about assimilation. no one wants that. Like the Scottish (also my roots) who fought the English for their independence. We are a colony, and we will always have that colonized mentality. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Fri 21 Nov, 2008 @ 11:32pm |
| Coolness: 339680 | What was lost? So ... Quebec sovereignists are fighting for whom since Quebec's birth? The side of the French? Last I heard Quebec wants nothing to do with France..
The notion that French cutlure is somehow threatened by English people is insane. Look around dude, everything we do is influenced heavily by the US. As much as Canadians want to claim to be different, we're not, all the movies we watch, the music we listen to, the products we buy, the food we eat.. this is all Americanized (compared to the rest of the world). You think keeping the French language is gonna change something? You're crying over a chipped nail when you broke your hand. Whatever inequality the French in Canada had at one point no longer exists, in fact I would argue it's reversed. Being French in Canada gives you more rights than being English (ask yourself how many Prime Ministers in the past 30 years weren't from Quebec). |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» databoy a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 12:09am |
 Coolness: 106130 | Originally Posted By THE.NEOFORM
What was lost? So ... Quebec sovereignists are fighting for whom since Quebec's birth? The side of the French? Last I heard Quebec wants nothing to do with France.. Where did you hear this? For the sake of this discussion, i believe French here mean "French Canadian", not "from France" The notion that French cutlure is somehow threatened by English people is insane. Look around dude, everything we do is influenced heavily by the US. As much as Canadians want to claim to be different, we're not, all the movies we watch, the music we listen to, the products we buy, the food we eat.. this is all Americanized (compared to the rest of the world). You think keeping the French language is gonna change something? You're crying over a chipped nail when you broke your hand.
You are right in saying that the American culture is the dominant one in North America, Its been that way since the end of ww2. So you say Anglo Canadians should worry about this reality? and French Canadians should just give up because... The notion that French culture is somehow threatened by English people is insane? ...!? Whatever inequality the French in Canada had at one point no longer exists, in fact I would argue it's reversed. Being French in Canada gives you more rights than being English (ask yourself how many Prime Ministers in the past 30 years weren't from Quebec).
Actually, being French in Canada most of the times means being bilingual, and being bilingual, though it wont give you more rights, will most likely mean more opportunity's . Find one single right the French Canadians have that the English dont have. Either you are trolling or profoundly confused. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 12:15am |
 Coolness: 685605 | Originally Posted By DATABOY
Find one single right the French Canadians have that the English dont have. Conducting/presenting their buisness in their mother tongue? In some areas, getting spoken to in their language at a hospital. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» databoy a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 12:30am |
| Coolness: 106130 | You saying Canadians dont get to chose what language they do business in?
Have you ever tried to get served in French anywhere in Canada outside of Quebec and New Brunswick? I have always found it quite funny and ironic to hear anglo-Montrealers bitch about there rights to live in English, but then totally deny the French Canadians the right to live in French. I just dont get it. If anyone should understand... |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Mico a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 12:35am |
| Coolness: 150475 | Originally Posted By SCREWHEAD
Conducting/presenting their buisness in their mother tongue? In some areas, getting spoken to in their language at a hospital. Considering the amount of immigrants who would sooner learn English over French, in a French speaking province, enforcing French as a official language in this province is reasonable. On a flip note, enforcing that French be the only language spoken in hospitals, as well as in provincial services (witch the PQ wish to legislate), considering the percentage of the English speaking population, is some what extreme. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» databoy a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 12:40am |
| Coolness: 106130 | Originally Posted By MICO
On a flip note, enforcing that French be the only language spoken in hospitals, as well as in provincial services (witch the PQ wish to legislate), considering the percentage of English speaking population, is some what extreme. Its not just extreme, its downright dangerous. What a ridiculous idea. I hadn't heard that one. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 12:54am |
| Coolness: 685605 | Originally Posted By DATABOY
Its not just extreme, its downright dangerous. What a ridiculous idea. I hadn't heard that one. man, I'm not even up to date on recent news, but I remember that being a problem 8-9 years ago already, I think in the Sherbrooke area; people who didn't speak english were refused a translator or an english-speaking doctor at a hospital. This same hospital only had french signs, so they were constantly getting lost since they had no idea what they were looking for. |
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| Good [+2]Toggle ReplyLink» recoil a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 1:22am |
 Coolness: 86520 | Originally Posted By N.A
Like the Scottish (also my roots) who fought the English for their independence. We are a colony, and we will always have that colonized mentality. I'm not sure what you mean by your usage of the words "colony" and "colonized". you can't be part of a colony and be colonized at the same time. Perhaps you meant to say *colonial* mentality, though I'm not trying to put words in your mouth... it would just make much more sense that way... hehe. Both the English and the French were colonists. It was new territory, for them. re: Scotland... Scotland is not independent. They actually gave up their independence a long time ago to become part of the United Kingdom. I'm not saying I agree with this, it's just how it is. The Scots are a distinct people with their own language history and culture. People were speaking Scots Gaelic in Scotland in Roman times. There was no Quebecois people living here back then. They came from France and took as big a chunk as they could getover. They were the colonists. I kinda see what you mean, but comparing the story of the Quebecois identity to that of an ancient European culture muddies the water a bit I think. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Blisss a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 4:18am |
 Coolness: 129735 | I don't think you need to be ancient to be a culture
The Quebecois do have a culture that is distinct and a language of their own. Thats here to stay, its not gonna dissapear in 10 years or something, in 400 years there will still be a culture and a people here. I think a lot of problems would be fixed if more Anglophones actually LEARNT FRENCH instead of always trying to get by with excuses. Most francophones I know have taken the time to learn english, so its only respectful to return the favor |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» recoil a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 4:58am |
| Coolness: 86520 | ^^^
yes I agree absolutely that people should learn French and respect the culture. I am entirely sympathetic to their desire to preserve their unique identity. perhaps my post was crudely worded because I certainly dont want to give any disrespect - I actually have a great deal of respect for the Quebecois culture. I didn't say being ancient was necessary, but the Quebecois experience is a bit different from say that of the Scottish or the Irish. They were fighting on their own soil, where they have lived for thousands of years, to remain sovereign. I guess I get uneasy when I hear people say "oh we went through what the Irish went through or what the Scottish went through", because it's not like that. I see it more as the fallout of a struggle between two colonial powers, in a land taken from the First Nations peoples. The First Nations were the ones who really got screwed. *they* were the ones who got assimilated. Makes any other peoples' sense of historical injustices pale in comparison. Not that those grievances aren't just as real, but they are not even close to what other peoples suffered.. at the hands of French and English colonialism. that's all I'm saying but it's also a very very complex issue and people will see it as they see it. it's all relative |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Nathan a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 8:54am |
| Coolness: 166560 | recoil, to be in a colony, you have to have been colonized...so i meant that some people here have the mentality of a people who have been colonized... i think you're kinda nitpicking buddy :P
On the other note, my immediate family is Scottish, so i guess i was using a personal example, but i was only drawing a comparison between the fact that they were both fighting the English for rights and land (which is true). Never said it was the exact same situation. No one would ever argue the plight of the First Nations in all this... Anyway, you're right too, but at this point it's all semantics and details. I was giving a brief opinion, not writing a thesis on the subject :) So i felt the need to justify myself, but i hate it when threads become about right and wrong rather than a collection of opinions... .. . salut |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» ApR1zM a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 11:50am |
 Coolness: 164815 | heaheah tres drole toute sa ... le quebec veux se separer parce que le deal cest quon donne une grosse partie de nos ressources au reste... dison quon SHARE plus que les autres fak on est tanne! cest bizzare personne parle de l alberta qui on le droit de garder leur profit petrolier en dehors de l'equation ! entk a date jai rien entendu de super intelligent venant du canada anglais pour defendre leur point tse jveux dire si qqun veux pu te parler pkoi tinsiste a vouloir qui reste ! on dirais le canada cest comme une ex qui veux pas decoller ! :P get a life tse nous on veux refaire notre vie a part ! ptete s'allier avec la bosnie ! w00t :D |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» recoil a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 1:44pm |
| Coolness: 86520 | Originally Posted By N.A
recoil, to be in a colony, you have to have been colonized...so i meant that some people here have the mentality of a people who have been colonized... i think you're kinda nitpicking buddy :P lol. a settler from overseas does not become colonized. the land and it's original inhabitants gets colonized. by the colonist. the colonists do not get colonized, because they were the ones doing it. this is why I drew the distinction. yes some people living in Quebec could have a colonial mentality. some Protestants in Northern Ireland, Brits living in India during the Raj, Boers and English in South Africa, Portuguese in Angola, could all be said to have a colonial mentality. but not the Scottish, because Scotland is their ancestral home. only an Englishman in Scotland could have a colonial mentality. You might think it's nitpicking, but ask a First Nations person living on a reserve who got colonized and they will tell you salut! |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Masa a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 2:06pm |
 Coolness: 158785 | Well, Canada was colonized both by the UK and France and when France let go of its "colonial rights", it could be argued that the French settlers were colonized by the UK, no?
But yeah, this is all moot at present, 'cept for the First Nations indeed. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» recoil a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 2:36pm |
| Coolness: 86520 | yeah I can see that. obviously I know they suffered through bullshit at the hands of the British here.
In terms of semantics, I don't think you can say the Quebecois were colonized by the English. but yes their land was expropriated and they were oppressed, definitely. they were colonists, who later suffered first oppression and later, discrimination at the hands of a rival colonial power. and it's much much more complicated than just that. If your ancestors have been living off the land here for hundreds of years, then it is your home. and as you said, now a moot point. these things are always much better discussed in person over a beer or whatever rather than typing posts on a message board. I love discussing these sorts of topics, but never have the energy to write more than one or 2 posts ez! |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Sat 22 Nov, 2008 @ 3:36pm |
| Coolness: 339680 | Originally Posted By BLISSS
I don't think you need to be ancient to be a culture The Quebecois do have a culture that is distinct and a language of their own. Thats here to stay, its not gonna dissapear in 10 years or something, in 400 years there will still be a culture and a people here. I think a lot of problems would be fixed if more Anglophones actually LEARNT FRENCH instead of always trying to get by with excuses. Most francophones I know have taken the time to learn english, so its only respectful to return the favor Why are you trying to assimilate my English Quebecer culture and rights? I demand English Quebec Separates from French Quebec! They're trying to hold us back and take away our rights! |
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