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Mafia Crackdown Targets 90 In Montreal
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer a répondu le Mon 27 Nov, 2006 @ 1:01pm |
 Coolness: 92345 | There's no such thing as someone who's educated in history that doesn't question history. The language isn't broken, I dunno where you see broken. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Mon 27 Nov, 2006 @ 1:07pm |
 Coolness: 339745 | You just rephrased it to be more understandable, but now it doesn't have any logic. How can you question history? History is supposed to be fact. If it's inaccurate than it isn't really history, it's fiction. |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer a répondu le Mon 27 Nov, 2006 @ 1:14pm |
| Coolness: 92345 | Fair enough although I was refering to history as we know it(and you knew that). Most of what is presented to you as history is questionable. Therefor what we consider as history is in large part fiction which is a fact in itself. The way to question history is by exploring each fact presented to you. The process of doing that involves: Finding out where the fact comes from, what evidence, what experiments, etc, and deciding if it makes sense by cross-referencing with unrelated histories and evidence. A good scientist for example, must question science as we know it.
So: There's no such thing as someone who's educated in history that doesn't question history as we know it. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Wizdumb a répondu le Mon 27 Nov, 2006 @ 1:28pm |
 Coolness: 122390 | history is meant to be questioned as you mostly hear only one side of the story |
| I'm feeling tired and broke right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer a répondu le Mon 27 Nov, 2006 @ 1:52pm |
| Coolness: 92345 | Yeah, more often than not the reason that history is misunderstood is not really about the facts themselves but where they fit into the puzzle.
Example- one can say that Exhibit A invaded Exhibit B because Exhibit B threw a rocket at them without ever mentioning that it was in response to Exhibit A blocking all goods and services from Exhibit B's borders. Now Exhibit A can say that they blocked all goods and services to their border because Exhibit B attacked them first. Now perhaps Exhibit B has performed these attacks because it's been constantly tormented, invaded and pillaged by Exhibit A who refuses to compromise. Perhaps Exhibit B has endured such treatment becuase they asked for it too. So what if we took only the bare fact that Exhibit A invaded Exhibit B because they were attacked? Then all of a sudden it becomes okay for Exhibit A to invade Exhibit B. Very dangerous stuff. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Wizdumb a répondu le Mon 27 Nov, 2006 @ 2:17pm |
| Coolness: 122390 | it's a dangerous game of semantics really, but unfortunately it's human nature to exagerate certain events for their own gain. history is a prime example of that. |
| I'm feeling tired and broke right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Bunnytronix a répondu le Mon 27 Nov, 2006 @ 11:31pm |
 Coolness: 152590 | Soooo mafia crackdown.
anybody affected by that? |
| I'm feeling cracktastic right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» basdini a répondu le Tue 28 Nov, 2006 @ 12:59am |
 Coolness: 145280 | The reason university is important is because it gives you an environment to test ideas out in, to receive critical feedback, the problem with you Neoform like most amatures is that you can't admit that proffesionals exist and that they are competent in the fields that they study, politics and social studies can be at times as techenical as chemistry or medicine...Why is it so difficult to believe that you may have to go to school to become trully profficient in things like this, the people who teach classes on subjects like these in university are usually people who have masters and PhDs and have been published in accademic reviews are you really going to maintain that your better educated then them. The other thing that university provides for you is access to the most recent books published about things your interested in, i can give you lists of books you should have read if you want to be considered an expert in some of the things you claim to know about, and i'm pretty sure you have not read them. If you don't beleive me go attend a higher level class(300-400 or better masters level) in something your interested in...political science or philosophy and see how the students of that class will tear you appart when you say something absurd. |
| I'm feeling surly right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Kishmay_Pinas a répondu le Tue 28 Nov, 2006 @ 1:20am |
 Coolness: 103335 | history can and should be questioned.
History is written by the winners. The history you learn is directly relevant to your geographic location. |
| I'm feeling like a beer right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Tue 28 Nov, 2006 @ 8:36am |
| Coolness: 339745 | Originally Posted By BASDINI
The reason university is important is because it gives you an environment to test ideas out in, to receive critical feedback, the problem with you Neoform like most amatures is that you can't admit that proffesionals exist and that they are competent in the fields that they study, politics and social studies can be at times as techenical as chemistry or medicine...Why is it so difficult to believe that you may have to go to school to become trully profficient in things like this, the people who teach classes on subjects like these in university are usually people who have masters and PhDs and have been published in accademic reviews are you really going to maintain that your better educated then them. The other thing that university provides for you is access to the most recent books published about things your interested in, i can give you lists of books you should have read if you want to be considered an expert in some of the things you claim to know about, and i'm pretty sure you have not read them. If you don't beleive me go attend a higher level class(300-400 or better masters level) in something your interested in...political science or philosophy and see how the students of that class will tear you appart when you say something absurd. are you out of your mind? Universities provide the most recent reading material?! the INTERNET will ALWAYS have that material WAY before a university gets a printed copy. That's the nature of the internet, as soon as the information is writen down, it's made available to everyone. i've met and talk to Ph.D's who are complete morons. i've spent almost 2 decades in school and know that i learn a lot more out of school than in school and i NEVER give people credit based on certificates alone. if you make a retarded assertions i won't care how many pretty pieces of paper on your wall. |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer a répondu le Tue 28 Nov, 2006 @ 9:31am |
| Coolness: 92345 | The difference is that people who are schooled in history wouldn't make retarded assertions cause they learn better than that on day 1. People who read articles on politicians on the internet do make retarded assertions, that's where most retarded assertions come from. You can't see the effects of any of those things yet. The very least you have to do is at least study ancient civilisations before you can understand what's happening here and now. A history student learns a large span of human history and it makes a huge difference. If you made that choice yourself that would be one thing. Full books and case studies are a good idea too rather than random internet clippings. It's true, you don't have to be in school to be educated in that but you aren't educated in that anyway. Your attitude makes it obvious. There can be people who haven't been through school who are way more educated on the subject but it doesn't change that you aren't one of them. It's possibel that you know mroe abotu certain subjects sure. You shoudln't trust someone just because they have a phD. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Tue 28 Nov, 2006 @ 9:43am |
| Coolness: 339745 | Books are compilations of many different things. Most of which are researched from other sources (the good ones anyway). If I bypass the book and go straight to those sources, I gain the benefit of not getting the authors 'view' on the matter and am able to make my own decisions instead of replying on his/her opinion on the matter. |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer a répondu le Tue 28 Nov, 2006 @ 10:32am |
| Coolness: 92345 | That's true. If you're directly reading the actual scientific report. Otherwise you'll just be subject to someone else's view. Most of the time the sources of a book are only used for very minscule things, they usually aren't even on the same subject. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Morphine a répondu le Tue 28 Nov, 2006 @ 10:38am |
 Coolness: 51050 | talk about calling the kettle black |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» basdini a répondu le Wed 29 Nov, 2006 @ 12:10am |
| Coolness: 145280 | Originally Posted By DJNEOFORM ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND? UNIVERSITIES PROVIDE THE MOST RECENT READING MATERIAL?! THE INTERNET WILL ALWAYS HAVE THAT MATERIAL WAY BEFORE A UNIVERSITY GETS A PRINTED COPY. THAT'S THE NATURE OF THE INTERNET, AS SOON AS THE INFORMATION IS WRITEN DOWN, IT'S MADE AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE. I'VE MET AND TALK TO PH.D'S WHO ARE COMPLETE MORONS. I'VE SPENT ALMOST 2 DECADES IN SCHOOL AND KNOW THAT I LEARN A LOT MORE OUT OF SCHOOL THAN IN SCHOOL AND I NEVER GIVE PEOPLE CREDIT BASED ON CERTIFICATES ALONE. IF YOU MAKE A RETARDED ASSERTIONS I WON'T CARE HOW MANY PRETTY PIECES OF PAPER ON YOUR WALL.
this isn't true at all, take the example of bob woodward's book "State of Denial" about the iraq war it wasn't available on the internet until after publication...On top of that there is no peer review for alot of stuff on the net. you have the attitude that "if i have not heard about it it's not important, if i don't know it yet, it's not worth knowing at all" i'll show you what i mean... you claim to understand politics especialy right Vs. left politics, the following two books essentially encapsulate the most important aspects of the the debate in contemporary political philosophy: John Rawls "A Theory of Justice" Vs Robert Nozick "Anarchy, State and Utopia" now i want you to go off and read those two books, and tell me who you agree with and why. If you don't want to do it i'll understand and i guess you'll have to admit that you don't know what you re talking about or worse you don't care to know. |
| I'm feeling surly right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Wed 29 Nov, 2006 @ 12:17am |
| Coolness: 339745 | fantastic, you've read two books and are convinced that everyone should read them.
got any favorite songs i should listen to while i'm at it? |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» basdini a répondu le Wed 29 Nov, 2006 @ 12:43am |
| Coolness: 145280 | it's not matter of liking them or not, everyone who has any serious interest in writting about or understanding politics in the modern world has actually read them, and has tried hard to understand the debate between the two authors...
you re not an expert or well read or well educated because you have the internet at your finger tips, because then everybody would be...and all the effort and hard work that people put in would be meaningless, you think punch lines win arguments you also think "if i don't stop arguing i can't be wrong" |
| I'm feeling surly right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform a répondu le Wed 29 Nov, 2006 @ 12:54am |
| Coolness: 339745 | you've got such insight into how i think.
i don't stop arguing because that's the only reason i come to this board. btw, you don't lose arguments by not stopping, you lose by making poor arguments. anyway, you're convinced that to be all knowing and of perfect mind you *have* to have read all the books you've read, good for you; i disagree. |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» nothingnopenope a répondu le Wed 29 Nov, 2006 @ 11:20am |
 Coolness: 201305 | I have to agree with basdini about reading books. Books generally have a lot more information than internet resources. Reading a few books on a subject is a lot more informative than reading a 3 page article on wikipedia. A well written book can be a well thought out resource which ties many ideas together into one coherent structure.
On the matter of politics I have found "radio open source" [ www.radioopensource.org ] to be a very balenced podcast on political subjects, it's no replacement for reading but it contains many interesting interviews from people all over the political spectrum. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» basdini a répondu le Thu 30 Nov, 2006 @ 2:09am |
| Coolness: 145280 | Originally Posted By DJNEOFORM YOU'VE GOT SUCH INSIGHT INTO HOW I THINK. I DON'T STOP ARGUING BECAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY REASON I COME TO THIS BOARD. BTW, YOU DON'T LOSE ARGUMENTS BY NOT STOPPING, YOU LOSE BY MAKING POOR ARGUMENTS. ANYWAY, YOU'RE CONVINCED THAT TO BE ALL KNOWING AND OF PERFECT MIND YOU *HAVE* TO HAVE READ ALL THE BOOKS YOU'VE READ, GOOD FOR YOU; I DISAGREE.
i'll put it to you by means of a simple analogy, this should make things pretty clear if you tell me that you are very interested and know a lot about classical music and i say to you "What do you think of Mozart?" and you answer with "i've never heard of him" then i think your claim to know alot about classical music seems to fall flat a little bit don't you agree? the same for almost every discipline if you say you know about something like communism and you've never read the "communist manifesto" or "Das Kapital" by Karl Marx how can you be expected to be taken seriously by everybody else who has? Real accademics and intellectuals make it their goal to know or atleast to know about, everything, that's ever been written, (especially of significance) about the topic that they study and claim to be experts in. you don't really get to chose what you think is important or not to have read or not (in a certain sense that is) if some one brings up sources or texts that you've never heard of it becomes your responsibility to go and find out about them especially if everybody else in the room who is supposed to be at your level has heard of it and is familliar with it. |
| I'm feeling surly right now.. | |
Mafia Crackdown Targets 90 In Montreal
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