Playstation 3 Related Death
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:06pm |
 Coolness: 685585 | ...or he could have had SOMETHING IN HIS HAND that at a glance COULD BE MISTAKEN FOR A GUN. |
| I'm feeling fat and sassy right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» greatjob replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:08pm |
 Coolness: 282450 | Originally Posted By __PHOENIX__
Originally Posted By DJneoform
Originally Posted By __PHOENIX__
After having beaten and robbed someone, do you think he was "just playing video games"? You make this guy out to be innocent or something.. Originally Posted By Betty_Haze this remember me that last week the nypd shot 50 times an innocent guy un-armed comming out of a strip club in queen.....for nothing..well he was black; but innocent.. the worse is that he was at the strip club for his own bachelor party and he was for getting married the following day... ;( very sad... at least bloomberg blame the cops on tv. I heard about that story as well and it's really tragic the way law enforcement sues the "kill first, ask questions later" policy but despite what they might want us to believe, their preemptive attacks are not only racially motivated, but they completely neglect that according to the law as it's still written people are: a) innocent until proven guilty, b) have the right to legal council. In this case the cops just busted into the guys place without a warrent, court subpoena, or security certificate and shot him dead without even charging him with a crime! Imagine getting gunned down by the cops in your own living room for nothing more than playing video games? thats fucked up... Dude, if anything he was guilty of assault and minor theft. Last I checked such crimes don't merit a death sentence. Why wouldn't the cops have used pepper spray, a stun-gun, or a baton to take him down (assuming he was even resisting arrest when they broke into his place). Tradionally, knocking on the door and following standard arrest procedure is what one might expect the cops to do, seeing as how this guy didn't pose any threat to national security. Instead, they used a "shoot first, ask questions later" policy" eventhough the guy hadn't been convicted (or even charge) with a crime,... The bottom line is that he was a suspect at most and legally, innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. The police involved should definitely be charged with breaking & entering, tresspassing on private property, excessive use of force, two counts of second degree murder (if you include the dog which, was obviously innocent of committing a crime), conspiracy to commit murder, obstruction of justice, and negligence causing death... with additional hate crimes if the preemtive attack was racially motivated. End of fucking story! |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Phoenix replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:08pm |
 Coolness: 81685 | Thats weird, I wish I had taken a screenshot before the article was removed,... here's an alternate link containing additional information on the story...
[ www.wilmingtonstar.com ] Update » Phoenix wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:13pm Fred, we all understand why the cop panicked and shot btu that still doesn't justify killing someone nor should they get away with it. However, If any regular citozen shot and killed someone "in self defense" and the victim was found holding a water gun, a gun-shaped lighter, a gun-resembling cell-phone, or anything else that could only be mistaken as a real gun by a complete idiot and should never be visually mistaken by police who, as far as I knew, are supposed to be trained professionals, we'd get charged with 2nd degree manslaughter and serve up to 15 years if convicted |
| I'm feeling you up right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:26pm |
| Coolness: 685585 | Well, I don't know what world you're living in, but a water gun/gun lighter ARE Things that cops can shoot you for. It's the main reason why there are laws in the US forbiding toy guns from being anything that looks realistic. They're all suposed to be flashy neon colors, because it's happened before that people pulled a "suicide by cop" using kids' toy guns.
Obviously, it's pretty fucked up that someone got shot for holding a PS3 controller, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with what the cops did. They busted the door to someone who'd commited a violent assault. They don't know how this person might react, what he may do. As they bust in, they see him with a black object in his hand, which may or may not be a gun. What if it WAS a gun that he'd had in his hand? What if they'd have broken the door down, come into the place, and hesitated because "well, you never know!" They'd be dead, plain and simple. |
| I'm feeling fat and sassy right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:44pm |
 Coolness: 92260 | Originally Posted By SCREWHEAD WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT WORLD YOU'RE LIVING IN, BUT A WATER GUN/GUN LIGHTER ARE THINGS THAT COPS CAN SHOOT YOU FOR. IT'S THE MAIN REASON WHY THERE ARE LAWS IN THE US FORBIDING TOY GUNS FROM BEING ANYTHING THAT LOOKS REALISTIC. THEY'RE ALL SUPOSED TO BE FLASHY NEON COLORS, BECAUSE IT'S HAPPENED BEFORE THAT PEOPLE PULLED A "SUICIDE BY COP" USING KIDS' TOY GUNS. OBVIOUSLY, IT'S PRETTY FUCKED UP THAT SOMEONE GOT SHOT FOR HOLDING A PS3 CONTROLLER, BUT THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING WRONG WITH WHAT THE COPS DID. THEY BUSTED THE DOOR TO SOMEONE WHO'D COMMITED A VIOLENT ASSAULT. THEY DON'T KNOW HOW THIS PERSON MIGHT REACT, WHAT HE MAY DO. AS THEY BUST IN, THEY SEE HIM WITH A BLACK OBJECT IN HIS HAND, WHICH MAY OR MAY NOT BE A GUN. WHAT IF IT WAS A GUN THAT HE'D HAD IN HIS HAND? WHAT IF THEY'D HAVE BROKEN THE DOOR DOWN, COME INTO THE PLACE, AND HESITATED BECAUSE "WELL, YOU NEVER KNOW!" THEY'D BE DEAD, PLAIN AND SIMPLE.
He MAY have been holding a controller, MAY HAVE. His dog was a german sheperd, they are really really sweet dogs, yes big, but if they were scared of it they should have tranquilised it. They should have tranquilised the fucking kid. Update » moondancer wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:47pm Man, they could have at least shot the dog in the leg, they didn't have to kill it.
I feel bad for the guy who reported this crime cause now he will just feel guilty for ever reporting it, it makes me scared to report robberies myself. What I'd like to know is wtf was that guy doing with 2 ps3's? Isn't there a limit of 1 per family? I mean that's just inconsiderate, I would have kicked his ass too. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:49pm |
| Coolness: 685585 | Yeah, tranquilisers are TOTALLY standard police weapons. Tranqs have to be spcific for each target, for one. The dose that would take out a human could kill an animal, the tranq that could take out a dog could be fatal to humans in tiny quantities. People might even be alergic to them and die anyways, but much more painfully and slowly.
And, uhmm, friendly or not, german shepherds are the primary dog used as guard/attack dogs, because of their loyalty and strength. If you kill a german shepherd's owner or break into it's territory, you'd better be fuckin' prepared for a hell of a good fight, because they are extremely vicious. |
| I'm feeling fat and sassy right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:54pm |
| Coolness: 92260 | Yeah well, there is something wrong with this picture. If there is any chance in the world that this is due to the stupidity of cops I will hang on to that chance, cause no one gets away with this kind of shit. If it was an innocent accident, a solution has to be found to prevent it in the future, it's not okay, sorry, it's just not acceptable.
His dad is a very wealthy lawyer though, so I hope that helps. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:57pm |
| Coolness: 685585 | Yeah, great idea, next time cops break down a door of a violent criminal (who, in this case, also owned a hunting rifle and 2 shotguns) they should give him time to explain what he's holding, just in case it's not something that could kill them. Update » Screwhead wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:58pm As for the 2 PS3s, there's not really a limit unless you order online. If you're at the store and have the money, they sell it to you. One for keeping and playing, and the other for putting up on ebay for at least 1000$ |
| I'm feeling fat and sassy right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:59pm |
| Coolness: 92260 | You're making assumptions, nobody said he was holding anything. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Phoenix replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 12:59pm |
| Coolness: 81685 | Fred, you realize that above you're implying that someone, either one of the cops or the theft suspect was inevitably going to get killed under the circumstances. Personally I find it hard to believe that shooting someone based on simple suspicion is standard police procedure. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 1:16pm |
| Coolness: 685585 | When police unexpectedly breaks the door down to someone who is being suspected of being a VIOLENT CRIMINAL, they should probably be prepared for the worst. It doesn't mean that someone is definitley going to get shot, but with VIOLENT CRIMINALS you never know what they're going to do, if they're going to be armed or not, for all they know they could have been kicking the door in to a gang's hangout in the middle of a 20 member reunion.
Cops are not superman, they can't see through walls. They're also not psychic and can't mentaly read a person's intentions. They aren't super-computers that can process everything in the room within a fraction of a second. |
| I'm feeling fat and sassy right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 1:51pm |
| Coolness: 92260 | Armed robbery doesn't make you violent, it makes you someone who wanted something and used selfish means to obtain it. There is nothing to suggest that this man had any sort of blood lust or psycosis.
Despite the fact that they can't see through the door, which is NEVER the case, anyone in their right mind would have shot the kid in the arm if they thought he was holding a weapon and if they don't have the good sense and processing skills to do this they aren't qualified. Everytime someone opens a door to a cop this uncertainty exists, if they must be absolutely certain each time that the person opening the door is not gonna shoot them, then they will have to shoot everyone everytime. Update » moondancer wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 1:52pm The only thing different about this situation and any other armed robbery is that the cop shot the suspect. |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» HumanBoing replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:00pm |
 Coolness: 39965 | ... look at that website, it's so fucking sketchy that I wouldn't trust it if they announced that israel bombed palestinians. Check your info sources before getting worked up guys. |
| I'm feeling bemused. right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:08pm |
 Coolness: 339660 | Originally Posted By __PHOENIX__
Originally Posted By DJneoform
Originally Posted By __PHOENIX__
After having beaten and robbed someone, do you think he was "just playing video games"? You make this guy out to be innocent or something.. Originally Posted By Betty_Haze this remember me that last week the nypd shot 50 times an innocent guy un-armed comming out of a strip club in queen.....for nothing..well he was black; but innocent.. the worse is that he was at the strip club for his own bachelor party and he was for getting married the following day... ;( very sad... at least bloomberg blame the cops on tv. I heard about that story as well and it's really tragic the way law enforcement sues the "kill first, ask questions later" policy but despite what they might want us to believe, their preemptive attacks are not only racially motivated, but they completely neglect that according to the law as it's still written people are: a) innocent until proven guilty, b) have the right to legal council. In this case the cops just busted into the guys place without a warrent, court subpoena, or security certificate and shot him dead without even charging him with a crime! Imagine getting gunned down by the cops in your own living room for nothing more than playing video games? thats fucked up... Dude, if anything he was guilty of assault and minor theft. Last I checked such crimes don't merit a death sentence. Why wouldn't the cops have used pepper spray, a stun-gun, or a baton to take him down (assuming he was even resisting arrest when they broke into his place). Tradionally, knocking on the door and following standard arrest procedure is what one might expect the cops to do, seeing as how this guy didn't pose any threat to national security. Instead, they used a "shoot first, ask questions later" policy" eventhough the guy hadn't been convicted (or even charge) with a crime,... The bottom line is that he was a suspect at most and legally, innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. The police involved should definitely be charged with breaking & entering, tresspassing on private property, excessive use of force, two counts of second degree murder (if you include the dog which, was obviously innocent of committing a crime), conspiracy to commit murder, obstruction of justice, and negligence causing death... with additional hate crimes if the preemtive attack was racially motivated. I wasn't there and neither were you. Maybe they used excessive force, maybe they didn't. Investigation is needed.. BUT don't play this sympathy bullshit saying he was just an innocent guy at home playing video games when the big bad police kicked his innocent door down when he never did anything to anyone. This guy beat the shit out of a nerd and stole $1000 worth of electronics from him. That makes him a criminal. |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» moondancer replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:27pm |
| Coolness: 92260 | I htink a cop has a responsibility that goes without saying when they become a cop - to put the lives of the public above their own. If there is an uncertainty, if you are afraid you might get shot, it is still your responsibility to take that risk in order to be sure that the person you are shooting needs to be shot. Otherwise you are killing exactly that which you're supposed to protect. He was supposed to protect that kid, but he didn't because he put his own life first.
Think of the Dawson shootings.. this guy was on a shooting rampage and the cops shot him in the arm, not the chest.. on a shooting rampage they had the good sense to do that, now we're talking about someone in their living room. It's not rocket science. If you're gonna piss your pants everytime someone opens the door, black shiny thing in hand or not, well you had better learn to calm the fuck down before someone gets hurt.. cause if someone gets hurt it should be you. Especially when that's your job, when you've spent how many years training for these situations exactly? And Neoform, you're talking about this as if your next door neighbour shot him. It was a fucking cop. Don't play this sympathy bullshit saying he was just an innocent cop who innocently shot a man because he was scared. What is this, Fruitsy Tutsi land? He's a goddamn cop. Fear is not an excuse. You gonna give him a lollipop everytime he does something right too? Update » moondancer wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:37pm The guy being a criminal is irrelevant at this point because by shooting the kid the cop wasn't protecting public safety, he was protecting his own safety |
| I'm feeling long gone right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Phoenix replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:28pm |
| Coolness: 81685 | until you're convicted of a crime you're a SUSPECT. You can't label someone a criminal until a judge or jury says so. Even if they were indeed guilty of committing the crime in question, legal semantics state that it has to be proven. All they had was some nerd claiming he got beat up and robbed by the suspect. Without other witnesses, a video recording, or some other means to back up the story it's nothing more than HEARSAY. That term is actually quite important in legal terms and a lawyer would would get a sustained objection if anyone aside from the actual assault/robbery victim (including the officers) told the (supposed beating/robbery) story on the stand because they weren;'t there to actually witness the apparent crime. The only physical evidence is the damage on the victim which, without other witnesses, still can't be linked directly to the suspect without reasonable doubt. It's his word against the suspect's and therefore the suspect likely wouldn't get convicted if the case went past the preliminary eharing to trial. Update » Phoenix wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:41pm bleh, not sure why I wrote "anyone" in that 2nd to last sentence... What I meant to say is that the suspect's defense lawyer would likely get a sustained objection if nobody aside from the victim could back up the victim's story... |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:50pm |
| Coolness: 339660 | That's why an investigation is needed and the other thing that is needed is you to stop taking everything the media is feeding you and assuming they've somehow given you all the details. For all we know the dude had a gun and was grabbing for it. Update » neoform wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:51pm Also, the dawson shooter was hit in the arm by accident. There's no way the cop was aiming for his arm, he was going for the chest and missed. |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Phoenix replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 2:59pm |
| Coolness: 81685 | "The dawson shooter"... fuck, you say it like the guy's a celebrity. Regardless of whether they were aiming for his chest or arm they reported that he shot and killed himself. Since the forensic autopsy likely wont be made available to the public I guess we'll never know for sure. The example is somewhat arbitrary anyways cause that guy was suicidal to begin with went in there with a deathwish so his goal was to eventually get hot and killed after killing and injuring as many other people as possible. Personally I would've prefered to hear that he was captured alive so that he could spend the rest of his life rotting in a 6x8 cell. Either way we're getting offtopic... justice wouldn't have been served whether he was convicted or killed and nothing could bring that poor girl back to life so in that particular case it really wouldnt have made much difference. |
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| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 3:50pm |
| Coolness: 339660 | Spend the rest of his life in a cell? Do you know how much it costs to keep someone locked up for 80 years? Millions.
I'm glad he's dead. One less psychopath murderer. |
| I'm feeling newsique.com right now.. | |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Phoenix replied on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 4:37pm |
| Coolness: 81685 | Millions? try thousands at most... it's not as if he'd be eating filet mignon with lamb chops and a quail leg entrée each meal. Besides which we're not barbaric like the americans so if he was caught and convicted, he'd definitely end up in a cell since thankfully, we don't have the death penalty here. Update » Phoenix wrote on Tue Dec 5, 2006 @ 4:42pm Anyways, money's artificial and more could be printed anytime if needs be (as it is already). I'm positive that even psychos could be put to some good productive use... assembly-line work if nothing else. I realize that sounds like a functionalist's mentality but I honestly believe that every person has the potential to improve and be a productive member of society (even if they've been isolated or quarantined from the majority of it's members...Killing people is such a waste, even if you're killing other killers there's no rational justification and that would just reduce the law enforcers to the level of the the very same killers they're trying to make examples of. |
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Playstation 3 Related Death
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