Hooray For Hate: Why "tolerance" Has Bec
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» mindset replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 7:32am |
 Coolness: 53225 | Said by DJneoform
i find it quite ironic that you would speak of tolerance.. yet without ever meeting me, or even uttering a word to me, you feel it necessary to plant on below my right eye. you are THE last person on this board who should be lecturing others on how to be tolerant when you can't even restrain yourself from being violent. and violence is MUCH worse then hate. since hate alone hurts no one, acting on hate does. As a response, i would just like to point out something called a Logical Fallacy, specifically Attack-the-Man-Not-The-Argument ( Ad Hominem ). Description of Ad Hominem Translated from Latin to English, "Ad Hominem" means "against the man" or "against the person." An Ad Hominem is a general category of fallacies in which a claim or argument is rejected on the basis of some irrelevant fact about the author of or the person presenting the claim or argument. Typically, this fallacy involves two steps. First, an attack against the character of person making the claim, her circumstances, or her actions is made (or the character, circumstances, or actions of the person reporting the claim). Second, this attack is taken to be evidence against the claim or argument the person in question is making (or presenting). This type of "argument" has the following form: 1. Person A makes claim X. 2. Person B makes an attack on person A. 3. Therefore A's claim is false. The reason why an Ad Hominem (of any kind) is a fallacy is that the character, circumstances, or actions of a person do not have a bearing on the truth or falsity of the claim being made (or the quality of the argument being made). Example of Ad Hominem Bill: "I believe that abortion is morally wrong." Dave: "Of course you would say that, you're a priest." Bill: "What about the arguments I gave to support my position?" Dave: "Those don't count. Like I said, you're a priest, so you have to say that abortion is wrong. Further, you are just a lackey to the Pope, so I can't believe what you say." Ad Hominem is just one of many logical fallacies, for a fairly complete list with descriptions & examples, this site is pretty good: [ www.nizkor.org ] |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Screwhead replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 10:12am |
 Coolness: 686270 | HOMINEM SOUNDS LIKE EMINEMS NAME IF HE WAS GAY.
WAIT. HE IS. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 10:50am |
 Coolness: 340345 | when someone loses a verbal argument, they resort to higher means, violence.
you like to think you're above us all, but in reality you're a childish little bastard who likes to use a dictionary to sound refined. you completely sidestepped what i had said, and did not even respond to it. what did you do instead? what you usually do, try to explain the nature of the message that the responder left in order to come off as the superior and a more inteligent person. your actions destroy your arguments. if i were arguing with someone that we shouldn't eat that pie cause it's poisoned, then turn arround and eat it.. you think anyone's gonna believe me that the pie's been poisoned? your actions are so impulsive you might as well not be using your brain. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» cloud9ine replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 10:58am |
 Coolness: 139400 | win. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» da_instagatah replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 1:02pm |
 Coolness: 144910 | i think people should be able to take jokes a little better.
including myself. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 1:07pm |
| Coolness: 340345 | do not mistake yourself ben, you deem my logic wrong because you dissagree with it. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» ontheroadagain replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 2:07pm |
 Coolness: 55015 | yo $pooky...you're one of the first people in a long time to make me go "hmmmmmmmmmmmmm....he may be right"....(then i thought "bah, that's just cause i haven't had coffee yet")
Now that i made my coffee, damn...you're still right...... *bows head in respectful acknowledgement* You can hate someone for what something they've done....no fear required... That said, true love cannot be a result of fear....being with someone for fear of being alone cannot be defined as love...because it's not. Hmmmm....y'know..maybe even hating someone for something they've done is based on fear...the fear of acceptance...not like peer pressure but accepting life, the way shit happens,as it happens and still marching on...it's easier to be bitter or hateful than it is to smile and move on... There were days when my heart was broken that i KNEW that i could be positive,strong and let shit go....but it was too scary so i stayed insecure....it took me awhile to let most of it go.... Fear of being strong and independent...i'm often scared to show my true strength,talents,abilities |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» ontheroadagain replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 2:08pm |
| Coolness: 55015 | oh and Ben...why did you punch Ian? |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» mindset replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:07pm |
| Coolness: 53225 | DJneoform said
if i were arguing with someone that we shouldn't eat that pie cause it's poisoned, then turn arround and eat it.. you think anyone's gonna believe me that the pie's been poisoned? altho a valid question in terms of opinion polling, who's "gonna believe you" is simply not a logical consideration. it's really not a debate - the strength and number of opinions is completely irrelevant to logic ( eg it was not the number of people who believed that the world was round was irrelevant to its proof ). here's a fun idea, lets do an opinion poll of the ravewavers who would actually bother to read/answer this: 1. THE MAN ARGUES THAT THE PIE IS POISONED 2. THE SAME MAN IS THEN SEEN EATING THE PIE WOULD YOU THEN: A) EAT THE PIE WITHOUT ANOTHER THOUGHT B) NOT EAT THE PIE WITHOUT FURTHER ENQUIRY |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» El_Presidente replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:17pm |
 Coolness: 300005 | I would first wait to saee if the guy dies, and if he doesnt i would eat it because i would be starving. But i hate pie anyways... |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» mindset replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:18pm |
| Coolness: 53225 | " you deem my logic wrong because you dissagree with it "
yes. i will not waste my energy on this one, and suggest u use it in this course: 340-901-78 Introduction to Logic Logic is the study of arguments and of the principles and procedures which allow us to distinguish good arguments from bad ones. Topics include: What is an argument? What is the difference between a deductive and an inductive argument? What makes an argument valid or invalid? What is the difference between validity and truth? Logic employs symbols to explain and enhance reasoning skills but no special competence in mathematics is required to succeed in this course. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» mindset replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:20pm |
| Coolness: 53225 | thierry's logical. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:23pm |
| Coolness: 340345 | "altho a valid question in terms of opinion polling, who's "gonna believe you" is simply not a logical consideration. it's really not a debate - the strength and number of opinions is completely irrelevant to logic ( eg it was not the number of people who believed that the world was round was irrelevant to its proof )."
what the hell does this have to do with anything? you're just reading parts of what i wrote and changing the argument completely. and what does this inquiry have to do with YOU saying one thing and acting in a completely opposite way..? you speak of tolerance and anti-hate yet you act depraved and violent with me. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» ontheroadagain replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:25pm |
| Coolness: 55015 | i'm still wondering why neoform got punched.... |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:27pm |
| Coolness: 340345 | you're fucking unbelievable..
telling me i should take university courses to somehow inprove my intelligence. you have this psychotic notion that school makes smarts.. wow, you majored in linguisitcs, and took various other courses.. i took chemistry, physics and mathematics.. who's smarter.. neither. courses do not make the person any smarter, merely more knowledgable. and NO course can ever teach logic. logic is an inherant thing that all humans have, some use it better then others, but it cannot be taught. this alone makes me think that your logic isn't being used properly, or you simply chose to ignor better reasoning merely to promote your own agenda. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 5:27pm |
| Coolness: 340345 | caj: so am i. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» mindset replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 7:09pm |
| Coolness: 53225 | i've seen children taught logic.
logic is a system of consistent rules for transforming premises into conclusions. logic does not make you right - it just helps ensure that if your premises are right, your conclusion is right. that's why in chess certain lines of play in certain situations are called 'logical'. at least i think so. i never said i was smarter than you. but it is a fact that the man in question who ate the pie may have been suicidal, and had decided to eat the poison pie. he wanted to die, but wanted no one else to. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 7:10pm |
| Coolness: 340345 | they don't teach logic, they teach what logic is. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» mindset replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 7:19pm |
| Coolness: 53225 | that was a dawson course.
the "what X is" statement is tautological. they don't teach math, they teach what math is. they don't teach english, they teach what english is. it's actually an argument that is based some of the inate natures of language - but that shiat is just word games. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Tue Feb 4, 2003 @ 7:38pm |
| Coolness: 340345 | alright then.
it's settled. they don't teach logic in school. |
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